If 9/11 Had Never Happened........

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by CyberForce, Nov 25, 2005.

  1. Deathwing

    Deathwing Well-Known Member

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    Don't take this as an offence but i don't think Bush had the guts to go in for any other reason. Let me explain. He probably knew it needed to be done but also knew the opposition it would have got from all the moral groups out there as well as all the rest. 9/11 gave him the reason he needed. Maybe it was the sensible thing to do, maybe not but i back it all the way. Ok so the WMD's weren't there (did anyone believe they were there in the first place) but the world is now rid of Tyrant Hussein and once the idiots fighting the US and allies realise its for the greater good of Iraq then they can rebuild and have a decent life compared to beforehand. Maybe pull all the soldiers out and let them fend for themselves. Ok npt fair on the innocent but when those attacking the soldiers get into power or whatever they want they will find they are the only ones left lol.

    I like Bush. He may come across as being rather dumb but i reckon its a huge front.

    -EDIT- By the way i live in UK
     
  2. daemonsabre

    daemonsabre Well-Known Member

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    lsn kid, you can only talk like that cause your from the U.K., you havent had your country occupied by foreigners nor have you got your family killed for some beauracratic war.

    Saddam as a tyrant would've stayed in iraq and done very little harm to the people in his country or to those around him, at least until he either died or was thrown out of power by a iraqi revolution. Instead people from both sides did needlessly

    And the WMD's were the entire point of the war, if saddam doesnt have WMD's then he isnt a real threat thus no reason for war. the soldiers who were sent there fought believing that they were protecting the world from WMD's, not fighting bush's private war

    'those idiots' who are attacking the U.S. soldiers are fighting cause there is a foregin army on their home soil who might've killed a brother father, sister or mother.... its never right to kill but what would you do in their position? waved a nice little american flag and then went home?

    and whats the gaurantee that things will get better,? Saddam at least ruled with an iron fist, he made sure economic policies were enforced, how do you know the next goverment wont be weak and mess the economy? iraq is in a state of confusion now, standard of living is decreasing great;y, even oil which is the most abundant resource is scarcely available to iraqis, not to mention the debt iraq will owe the U.S. after the troops pull out
     
  3. stott

    stott Well-Known Member

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    people still care about this topic?
     
  4. zon_--_

    zon_--_ Active Member

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  5. BumD!ckBum

    BumD!ckBum Well-Known Member

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    Why do poeple bother talking about subjects such as this. Your president was doing what he did for the good of your country. So what if he invaded iraq for oil. This is what leaders of countries have been doing since the dawn of countries. My advice. Get over it. You cant effect the outcome in any way whasoever.

    Our soldiers are helping iraq build itself up as a democracy, the way it should be. Do not criticise, you honestly have no idea what is going on.
     
  6. Sand_Man117

    Sand_Man117 Well-Known Member

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    i dont think that the war in iraq is related to much with 9/11 tbh. the war in iraq was about the oil after saddam hussein said that he refused to sell oil to america. if u remember before the war, oil prices were rising cos iraq makes loads of oil. obviosly bush saw this as a major threat to america as it relies heavily on oil imports. people dont understand how ----ed america would be without oil. so bush could do only one thing really, and invade iraq. however he did on some very wrong ideas like womd which was a bunch of crap.

    9/11 however is more to do with alcaide, and terrorism rather than an economical crisis. 9/11 was an act of terrorism and america then attacked afghanistan looking for bin laden, who they never actually found.
     
  7. BumD!ckBum

    BumD!ckBum Well-Known Member

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    nope. could not be further from the truth America has alot of oil of their own. in Texas and alaska

    They just chose to import because when it has run out then america will be the only ones with oil.

    Your leader/past leaders are not stupid. Thats why they were made president.
     
  8. Λtreyu

    Λtreyu Well-Known Member

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    lol...

    1, Iraq is no threat to the US. This war is not for our freedom.

    2, We have every damn right to question the war. Going along with what ever the president says is showing how mindless you really are.

    I agree completly with daemonsabre as well
     
  9. j_ball430

    j_ball430 Well-Known Member

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    We would never have stepped foot into Iraq nor Afghanistan if we had not been attacked. Why? Because the United States would still feel as if we were invincible and nothing could ever happen. Even if Bush had wanted to invade Iraq, it would never have gotten past either houses of Congress. There'd be too much to risk for no point at all.

    The war is not and never was for oil (anybody who thinks this is stuck in 2004 and has very little to absolutely no knowledge of the war). EVEN if it was, we would have had no reason to invade Iraq.

    Then again, even if 9/11 didn't happen, there could have been another major tragedy coming from offenders in the Middle East, and we could be in Iraq. However, we don't know this, so we can only speculate.
     
  10. daemonsabre

    daemonsabre Well-Known Member

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    The question isnt whether it was for the good of the country, we are no longer in the dark ages where each king fought for his castle, we are now in a civilised globalized world where rights of the individual, culture, country are supposed to be protected by U.N. law, the same law that americans helped write and that they broke so blatantly with iraq.

    Besides while this may or may not help U.S. economy later, would you say that in order to get cheaper oil the lives of american soldiers are a cheap price to pay?

    and yes we can affect the outcome, thats why its called democracy,

    and tell me, how do YOU know whats going on?

    do you know that food and water prices are skyrocketing in iraq?

    do you know that oil is rationed out among civilians while U.S. tanks always have full tanks?

    do you know the number of families who have fathers or mothers dead by a missile with a U.S. flag next to it?

    do you know the number of children that will pickup a gun and join the fight against U.S. soldiers?

    do you know how many of them will be adopted by terrorist organisations?

    do you know the number of U.S. families that have lost a father, brother, son because of a war that did nothing of what it promised?

    in truth people who have just been sitting on the sidelines watching, doing nothing, not caring and remaining silent are those who know the least.
     
  11. j_ball430

    j_ball430 Well-Known Member

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    "do you know that food and water prices are skyrocketing in iraq?"
    - Typical of wartime. It'll improve, it always does.

    "do you know that oil is rationed out among civilians while U.S. tanks always have full tanks?"
    - Why shouldn't they be? Are our troops supposed to defeat the opposition while having empty tanks? Civilians must make sacrifices because guess what? Our troops are sacrificing MUCH MORE. It's the least we can do, and how about not bitching about it?

    "do you know the number of families who have fathers or mothers dead by a missile with a U.S. flag next to it?"
    - It's a tragedy of war. War is not pretty. Are we supposed to just drop our weapons and make love? Stop smoking that weed, you're not in the 1960's.

    "do you know the number of children that will pickup a gun and join the fight against U.S. soldiers?"
    - You answer this in your next question. They are adopted by terrorist organizations.

    "do you know how many of them will be adopted by terrorist organisations?"
    - Kids are gullible. This is why they believe in Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny. They'll listen to adults. Why else do you think kids that are around vulgar adults start swearing at a young age? They look up to those older than them.

    "do you know the number of U.S. families that have lost a father, brother, son because of a war that did nothing of what it promised?"
    - Just because the media and you believe that the war has done no good doesn't make it true. Try looking deeper past the mainstream media, you may actually hear the positives.
     
  12. daemonsabre

    daemonsabre Well-Known Member

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    -not neccesarily, afghanistan's economy is still in the dirt

    -They didnt ask the troops to come in, the troops came in, did the damage and took the spoils of war, more like a conquering army than a saving force

    -Its a tragedy that should have never occured, when there is war there are casualties, when the war is preventible they are victims

    -you go to some random kid right now and ask him to join a terrorist organisation, he's more likely to say no cause his parents have raised him. then wait till a missle kills his family, he'll pickup that gun himself. like you said kids are gullible, a kid around war will grow to be violent without proper guidance, when that guidance has a U.S. bullet in his/her head he cant be blamed when he hates all that america stands for.

    -name me the positives....
    saddam gone: couldn't have done much harm if he wanted to
    the economy: its in the ---- hole with no light at the end of the tunnel
    saving the iraqi people: iraqi's dont want you there nor did they ask to be saved
    prevent terrorist attacks: i think you just agreed with me that this war has just made a ----load more people willing to fly a plane into the U.S.
     
  13. gbull

    gbull Well-Known Member

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    America fought this war only for Iraq's oil. - FALSE

    When you make this assumption you show your complete incompetence toward the truth and borrow all of your ideals from such well known scholars as Eminem and Madonna. While what I said maybe completely untrue, it is undeniable that you sound completely ignorant even to most of the critics of the war. For God's sake, stop makeing this assumption. It's tired, it's old, and it's untrue.

    Will America Fall as a Superpower? - Probably

    No superpower lasts forever, even if it takes the apocalypse to end America's prosperity. The growing population of China also points toward this. Let me ask you all: would you feel better if China was in charge, or America? I sure would feel much more content with America in the driver's seat.


    Now for you people who are critics of our president. I remember a quote:
    </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE ("zon")</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Bush and the goverment exploited the grief and anger that most americans felt because of 9/11, simply to get their filthy and bloodstained hands on the oil.[/b][/quote]
    Is Bush not an American? Did he not feel the same grief and anger that as you so elequently put, "most" Americans felt because of 9/11. It is my belief that he started this war because he thought it was the RIGHT thing to do. He was given information that Iraq possessed Weapons of Mass Destruction. So with that reason, and for a few others, he acted on that feeling. It's obvious that congress felt the same, so they allowed him to go to war.

    Just a few things to ponder.
     
  14. &#923;treyu

    &#923;treyu Well-Known Member

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    sure, he had 'information' concerning WMD's, but that gave him no right to go to war. He disregarded the UN in the most ingorant way managable, and went to war. The UN had no real evidence of Iraq having WMD's, and bush disregarded it. If a president lets his emotions get in the way of running a country, he should not be in that position. His job is not to make us happy, it is to secure the nations freedom and run this country the best way possible. our freedom was not at risk, and he is not leading this country into a bright future.
     
  15. j_ball430

    j_ball430 Well-Known Member

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    Afghanistan's economy was in the craphole before we "invaded". You can blame the Taliban for that.

    What does that have to do with my comment? I just said that it's better for our troops to be equiped to defeat our enemy. Do you want to see more troops killed? Of course, not, so why try and hinder them by demanding that they don't have unrestricted access to resources they need to have in order to survive?

    The war was not necessarily politically necessary, but morally, I truly believe it was and still is.

    Children are going to get mad at anybody who hurts their parents, whether or not they're in the right or wrong. If a parent gets fired, the child is going to be mad. If the parent is arrested, the child will be mad. Wrong or right, a child will act irrationally.

    Saddam: No, he couldn't have done anything politically or militarily, but he could have continued to wipe out his own citizens and fund terrorist cells who could further attack the US or any other ally of the US.

    Economy: It's looking up. Most of the problems in the economy are not due to the war. It's all the business going overseas because labor unions are driving up wages sending corporations over seas.

    Iraqis: Again, mainstream media. Look past the mainstream media, there are PLENTY of people supporting our efforts. Sure, they don't necessarily like our continued occupation of their nation, but unlike before, they've been able to express their opinions. I'm sure many more disliked Saddam than dislike the US military.

    Terrorism: Everything the US does aggrivates someone. It's never ended, regardless of what it is we do. Also, by stopping the terrorist cells, we're stopping the mass attacks that are only possible throughout these cells.
     

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